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Re: [APML] computer video card
you are right about the speed at which things move in the industry. I
actually worked very closely with all the major cpu, chipset and graphics
card vendors as well as Anand Lal Shimpi, of Anandtech, Tom of Tom's
hardware and many other "analysts" in the PC industry for nearly 10 years.
And of course the motherboard makers, graphic card makers and the systems
houses such as HP, and Dell and IBM.
I am well acquainted with the players and their capabilities. For all the
bashing they receive, I still think Intel is the best across the board when
it comes to the components. There are times when one company or another gets
ahead of them for a quarter or two, but Intel is never down for long: they
are the 800 lb gorilla.
Of course I understand the hacker world likes the snappy attitude of Via and
I know that they do make some good products, but they also have rushed junk
to the market that wasn't really stable and ready for production and that is
not something that happens very often with Intel.
Sorry for the off-topic. I really would like to take this offline if you
care to discuss more. I have lots of war stories I can share from my days in
that biz... (know Taiwan and many of the players over there very very very
well for example).
rdc
----- Original Message -----
From: "Craig Michael Uter" <cmutter@verizon.net>
To: "Richard Crisp" <rdcrisp@earthlink.net>; "Discussion of Film
Astrophotography" <astro-photo@seds.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 5:17 PM
Subject: Re: [APML] computer video card
> Well I hate to disagree with you too Richard, but remember that 3 years in
> this computer industry is a veritable lifetime. I've never owned a
> motherboard with Intel chipsets (partly because I'm cheap) and have never
> had a problem with any of them. I've been building my own from scratch for
6
> years now and they've all stood up to the toughest torture (my two kids
and
> my wife).
> Perhaps the motherboard version you were trying was a newer chipset from
VIA
> and it didn't have all the bugs worked out, that has been known to happen
;
> ^ ) . Try this site: www.anandtech.com it's run by a young man and he has
> the "Latest and Greatest" info on motherboards and what's new in the
> computer industry as well as doing superb reviews on all types of computer
> equipment. I always check his site for info on motherboards and graphic
> cards before I buy.
>
> Craig Utter
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard Crisp" <rdcrisp@earthlink.net>
> To: "Discussion of Film Astrophotography" <astro-photo@seds.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 12:10 PM
> Subject: Re: [APML] computer video card
>
>
> > I hate to disagree with you Craig, but my experiences with the VIA
> chipsets
> > has been spotty at best. It has been about three years since I last used
a
> > motherboard with a VIA chipset, and after that experience, I doubt I
will
> > use them again. It is possible they finally figured out how to make
their
> > stuff work, so again my experience may not be representative of the
status
> > quo today.
> >
> > In a nutshell their PC133 "compatible" chipset would not boot up until
the
> > BIOS was set to let the SDRAM run at 66MHz, exactly half of what it
should
> > have run. I returned the motherboard twice and all three of them worked
> > equally bad. I finally just exchanged it for one using the Intel chipset
> and
> > never had a problem again.
> >
> > Back in the '60s there was a saying among IT managers that "no one gets
> > fired for going with IBM". In the modern world of the cost driven PC, I
> > would modify that to say "no one gets fired for going with Intel". I
will
> > stick to the name brands and let someone else gamble with AMD and Via,
the
> > second string in my book.
> >
> > Richard
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "cmutter" <cmutter@bellatlantic.net>
> > To: "Discussion of Film Astrophotography" <astro-photo@seds.org>
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2004 7:55 AM
> > Subject: Re: [APML] computer video card
> >
> >
> > > WAit a minute, your talking about two different types of "Chipsets"
> here.
> > First VIA makes the controller chipsets for motherboards and are
> considered
> > some of the most stable chipsets available even moreso than Intel's. Now
> > nVidia makes the chipsets for graphics cards not for motherboards. AMD
> > liscences their chipsets through VIA.
> > > lets be sure we're comparing "apples to apples"
> > >
> > > Craig Utter
> > >
> > > "Lane, Jason R" wrote:
> > >
> > > > Speaking of the difference between Ford and Chevy, the AMD processor
> > isn't the cause of software incompatibility problems (unless it is
> > physically defective). More often, it is caused by bad chipset designs
in
> > the motherboards, or hardware incompatibility with the motherboards.
You
> > just have to know what to shop for. VIA chipsets have been notoriously
> bad
> > these past few years. Motherboards based on NVidia's chipsets are
> > remarkably stable and fast. AMD makes their own chipset that has always
> > been very stable (although not the fastest).
> > > >
> > > > Some folks might gripe about having to sort through hardware to pick
> > what's compatible or not, but the much lower cost of the processor is
> worth
> > it, IMO. Also, it's kind of like a telescope setup or a automobile..you
> > just don't slap any old piece of equipment in it.
> > > >
> > > > Hopefully no more than $.02 up there. =)
> > > >
> > > > Jason Lane
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Dale Ireland [mailto:direland@drdale.com]
> > > > Sent: Friday, January 30, 2004 10:29 AM
> > > > To: 'Discussion of Film Astrophotography'
> > > > Subject: RE: [APML] computer video card
> > > >
> > > > Bob
> > > > Yes some have an agp slot. In fact the 4600 does have an agp slot.
The
> > 2400
> > > > does NOT have an agp slot and it is tricky to disable the integrated
> > video
> > > > cards. The integrated video cards have a way of returning to life
like
> a
> > > > zombie in the "Night of the living Dead". Integrated sound support
is
> > even
> > > > worse. I mean they work fine but don't get them if you know you
plan
> to
> > > > upgrade.
> > > > My experience is the same with the chips too. The best deal is to
take
> > the
> > > > option for the "next to best" chip. In other words don't get the AMD
> or
> > > > Celeron (lots of software incompatibility problems), but get the
next
> to
> > > > highest speed Pentium. The systems have an option for the very
fastest
> > > > expensive, say 3Ghz, but then there is a huge price difference if
you
> > get
> > > > the next one down, say the 2.8Ghz P4 which used to be last month's
top
> > chip
> > > > and is not noticeably different.
> > > > Dale
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: astro-photo-bounces@seds.org
> [mailto:astro-photo-bounces@seds.org]
> > On
> > > > Behalf
> > > >
> > > > Thought I would relate my experience:
> > > >
> > > > I've been building my own pc systems(and for friends) for ten years.
> I
> > > > generally avoid integrated video just because its one more layer of
> > > > complexity to disable it if you add another card. Also, they tend to
> > share
> > > > ram as opposed to having their own separate on-board ram. I like to
> > keep
> > > > things simple. However, most rules are meant to be broken. It is
not
> > true
> > > > that motherboards with integrated video do not have an agp slot.
Many
> > do
> > > > also have an agp slot. Thus you can add a second card (meaning a
> second
> > > > monitor). With the low price of good video cards (including dual
> video
> > > > cards) I would skip the integrated and go for a 128mb dual display
> card
> > for
> > > > $100 or less. This is also easier to setup up if you want dual
> > displays.
> > > >
> > > > A lot depends on how comfortable you are getting around the inside
of
> > your
> > > > machine, mananaging drivers pulling cards etc.
> > > >
> > > > Newer pcs should have a minimum of 512mb Ram because of the bloated
> OS.
> > > > Older pcs have some limitations on how much ram they can access.
> > > >
> > > > On the flipside, I also have a g5 Dual 2gig with 2.5 gigs of memory.
> > There
> > > > are 8 memory slots (for a total of 8gb ram). I use it for video
> editing
> > and
> > > > I allot 1.5 gigs to the program. I have not heard of programs not
> being
> > > > able to access more than 1g. I purchased this machine because of
the
> > > > editing software(it is not available for the pc).
> > > >
> > > > I would add to Dales comments: Avoid the celeron chip and get the p4
> (or
> > > > AMD).
> > > >
> > > > Hope this helps.
> > > >
> > > > Bob Seabold
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > http://seds.org/mailman/listinfo/astro-photo
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