Re: [APML] OT: digital vs film

["William R. Mattil" <wrmattil@ix.netcom.com>]

Robert Gendler wrote:
> 
> Since we are all airing important points I'll make another which
> I think needs to be made.
> 
> Underlying some of the "film vs CCD" debate is the topic (myth) of money.

Not very many of "us" have unlimited sources of funds to finance the
latest CCD devices Robert. Sorry to burst that bubble for you. But
someone had too.

> The theme goes like this: Film is the do it yourself poor man's medium
> and the results reflect on the astrophotographers skills. CCD on the
> other hand is expensive but somewhat automatic method of making
> astroimages which requires less skill.

This is unadulterated BS and smacks of elitism Robert. When I was 14
years old there wasn't a chance that I could afford a Nikon Camera Body,
or the necessary bits to do the development either. 

> Let me dispel this myth.

I'm all ears ....

> It is true that in the early stages film astrophography requires less of an
> investment
> than CCD but it is also absolutely true that to do either at the "highest"
> level requires
> substantial monetary investment in the best possible equipment. There's no
> way around
> this fact of life. Great images cannot be made without the best telescopes
> and mounts,
> cameras and scanners.

You have of course empirical evidence to support this supposition Robert
? Have you ever done Astrophotography using film ? You speak very
knowlegably about the financial resouces necessary to do this and yet
offer no evidence. What you can certainly attest to is that spending
money doing CCD imaging is not an issue for you. Good. But unless you
can offer up some anecdotal evidence regarding film this is still
unsubstanciated opinion.

> 
> Well respected and beloved film artists such as Tony, Chuck, Bobby and many
> others
> who have consistently produced the best astrophotos out there have all spent
> small fortunes
> financing their hobby. Its not only spent on equipment but lots of money has
> been spent on
> relocating to dark sites. I cannot relocate at this time so I invest in good
> equipment to offset
> the horrible conditions I have here in the NE.

So you are telling us that this is a rich mans game then ??? If so I
agree. :^)

> Jokes are made about the cost of CCD cameras but I would venture that Bobby
> M's BRC
> cost the same as my RC and "top of the line" scanners cost the same as CCD
> cameras.

You would lose that bet ........ And besides Mr. Middleton produces some
stunning images with a 12.5 Inch Newtonian that probably didn't cost as
much as the computer that you use to process images.

> The STL11000 cost the same as an astrophysics apo. BTW I traded my ST10 and
> AO7 to
> finance the cost of the new camera. Hey how about the cost of all those home
> observatories?

$10,000.00 is not necessary to build a reasonable home observatory. And
let me point out that while you apparently suffer from the delusion that
everyone on this list uses an Astrophysics Refractor they most assuredly
do not. 

> The second myth is the ease of CCD imaging. I'd be happy to provide a CD
> with the
> raw M42 fits files for anyone who wants to take a crack at it. The data is
> so contaminated
> from light pollution it will certainly challenge the processing skills and
> frustration level of
> even the most seasoned imager.

Tell you what Robert ..... I'll fly up to your "digs" and use *your*
equipment and produce an image. You fly down here to mine and use *my*
equipment and see for yourself how hard imaging really is. Sheesh ....

With the help of many of the people on this *film* list I have managed
to produce images that I am very happy with. The total invested in doing
this was less than the cost of your mount. Period. And to be honest
Robert your elitism just rubs me the wrong way. 
 
> Enough said.

Ya think ??? <g>


My Apologies to the list .....


Regards

Bill
-- 
William R. Mattil	|                              
wrmattil@ix.netcom.com	| http://celestial-images.com      
(972) 399-4106		|
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